DP Canada Forums

[Adair]

American Disabilities Act - 20 Year Anniversary 7/26/2010

Giving people the opportunity for a full life. May Canada take the best parts of the US Law and provide these protections to Canadians.

Poll runs 14 days
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Adair

[De2164]

I cannot vote of course on this being American but I just want to say while it is expensive, it is a vital thing for those that suffer from a disability and cannot compete in the market place as a fully functional person can. It helps the Community, the Employer as well as the disabled employee.
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DAvid

"With a rubber duck, one's never alone"

[IonaV]

I'm really not sure how to vote in this.

Canada does have protections in place for the disabled--perhaps not as extensive or detailed as the ADA; however, there are building regulations to ensure that new office and/or public buildings have adequate accessibility for the disabled. The Canadian Constitution and Charter of Rights covers such rights--this particular section has been in force since 1985 (3 years after the Constitution was signed in 1982 in order to allow other Canadian government jurisdictions (i.e, provinces, territories, cities, etc.) to get their laws into line):

[Long Green]

Thanks, Adair.

I, also, do not have a vote in Canada. My quibble with the question is that it need not cost a lot of money, but it does require some planning. Retro-fitting is expensive. The "planning" here had been: "It doesn't matter if people with disabilities can get into our public buildings or not. If people with disabilities or their parents/siblings contribute to the taxes which support facilities, it doesn't matter that they cannot use them."

It doesn't cost more to put in curb-cuts than to build the curbs. It just takes thinking before you put up the forms for the curb. In public buildings here, where there is now a well-built, convenient ramp in addition to the steps, more people use the ramp than use the beautiful steps. Delivery people love it!

We now have some stores which are not truly accessible wondering why few people shop there rather than in the stores which are accessible. Try getting your baby-stroller through a door while opening and holding open a door with one hand and holding the hand of your older child with the other! Try going to your favorite restaurant after breaking your leg on a ski trip or your neck after a diving accident. Try taking your grandmother who doesn't walk well any more someplace with her oxygen bottle in tow. Try wheeling down a sloped sidewalk only to discover a flight of steps down at the end. <frightening>

Think about being fined/jailed for not showing up for a trial when the reason was that you couldn't get into the courthouse. Think about not being able to go to school because you cannot get inside the building.

That's why the ADA is important here. You don't need a CDA if all your citizens, including injured veterans, can access all buildings open to the public. Some of the primary movers who helped get this passed have been our veterans. They are still working to get parts of it implemented more fairly. Many have returned with severe head trauma and hearing loss.

Yes, some of the legal suits have been a bit ridiculous. But there are others, painted as being ridiculous by the press, which really aren't ridiculous. Example, one company said that a driver who needed a hearing aid to do a particular job couldn't be hired because his hearing aid might not be working, but that a person who needed glasses to do the same job could be hired even if he broke his glasses. Go figure —
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Mama Beth

Everything is connected.
Having the legal right to do something doesn't mean it is the morally right thing to do.

Join the Table Tamers Team

[IonaV]

I do want to thank Adair for adding this poll; even just the discussion helps people to understand that disabled people have the same rights as non-disabled.

City/town planners (at least in areas of Canada where I have lived--Alberta and BC) must be "thinking", Mama Beth. ALL new subdivisions must have sidewalk ramps at the corners and older subdivisions as well as older areas of business districts have had the sidewalk corners replaced with ramps--it's been going for years. Most, if not all, public buildings have level entrances: that is, level with the sidewalks--no steps; or there are ramps. And yes, delivery people love such ramps!! Not to mention parents with strollers and the kids on skateboards....

There is still the odd, old building that may have a single step at the entrance. Our lawyer does --we discovered that when we took my mother-in-law there in her wheelchair. However, after that, the lawyer came out to our house which was very kind of her.

Whether or not Canada needs a separate Disabilities Act is something requires a lot of discussion. I do remember the "discussions" and controversy around our Charter of Rights--you know, whether or not it was needed. But the government (Liberals under Pierre Elliot Trudeau) pushed it through as part of the repatriation of our Constitution.

I think most people today would be surprised at the comments made 30 years ago about "equality" rights for everyone.

Naturally, there are still lots of people who are not aware of the rights of the disabled. There is still the occasional report of store or restaurant owners/managers not allowing service dogs onto their premises; however, they are soon reminded of the laws by other people if not the cops. I also get really ticked off by people who park in disabled parking spots.

We have an MP (Member of Parliament), Steven Fletcher, who is a quadriplegic. The Parliament Buildings required a "bit of renovation" when he was first elected in 2004--I remember the news reports about it: they had no choice, renos had to be done to accommodate him. He is currently a Cabinet minister--the first with a permanent disability--and remains a defender of the disabled.
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Iona

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson

[stygiania]

I think it would be a good thing if those who practice the building trades spent some time trying to navigate through their normal daily tasks while in a wheelchair. Then perhaps they would realize that moving the door handle lower does not change the fact that the door pull-weight is too high to be opened from a seated position (if my almost-8-year-old isn't strong enough to open a door, someone in a wheelchair probably cannot either) or that making a bathroom stall six inches wider and adding grab-bars still doesn't mean there is enough room in there for the stall door to be closed without removing the wheelchair or for the person to transfer from chair to toilet in privacy.
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Love me, feed me, take me home!

[IonaV]

I agree, Styg, 1000% (extra zero is deliberate!! ).

There are various disabled support groups as well as organizations like "wheelchair sports" groups who do sponsor special events for young people (including college/university students): the young people must spend the day in a wheelchair. Their eyes are certainly opened when they realize that wheelchairs cannot go everywhere and can be extremely difficult to operate even under the best circumstances.

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I don't know how many of you were able to watch the Opening Ceremonies for the 2010 Winter Olympics in Vancouver. Rick Hansen of "Man in Motion World Tour" fame brought the Olympic Torch into the stadium--which I was very happy to see--and he was also involved in the 2010 Winter Paralympics. He has done a great deal over the years to help the average Canadian understand more about people who must "live" in wheelchairs.

I'm not forgetting American paraplegics (or quadriplegics like Christopher Reeve) who have done the same thing for Americans; it's just that I know Hansen's history much better.
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Iona

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson

[Long Green]

I does seem as though Canada's legal position is much more like our current law than it was here 20 years ago. I do not know which issues, if any, yet need to be covered there.

Even when things meet the law, they're often not useful. The law was written by the builders and enforced by the building code people. It is rare that either have ever lived with a person with a mobility problem nor had one themselves. The most helpful people I find when I need help tell me about a family member who needs help. They see differently. I cannot count the number of times I've waited at a closed door, even rapping on it or a window, and had people walk by me outside even when verbal requests were made, or look up from inside and not notice why I was rapping.

The most common disability is one of hearing loss; it has become more common now among young people for two reasons. 1] amplified music, especially with ear buds/earphones; and 2] military service which is often complicated by traumatic brain injury. Those IEDs are dreadful and it's hard to convince the soldiers that they need to wear ear protection whenever there is any chance of an explosion, especially when it's hot. Getting weather or other TV alerts captioned has kept many people busy with petitions. Note that other breaking news is often on a crawler. But what, if anything, is shown on the TV about something to which one must respond is still uselessly brief about the "where" and "when" in many markets.

Parents must teach about the former, constantly. We are seeing 11-year-olds with presbycusis resembling that of people in their eighties!

Mama Beth

[IonaV]

Of course, some of the people who "don't help" are not doing so since they don't want to get involved or don't really care since they don't know the individuals. It happens everywhere and is a poor statement about our societies.

You can certainly tell the "well brought up" young people (I made sure my sons were), they will hold doors open for seniors, people in wheelchairs, moms with strollers, etc. I always surprise those same young people when I thank them as there are lots of people who do not do so. I can remember (before my hair turned grey) when older, grey-haired, gentlemen would hold a door for me (who was very capable of doing so)--I always thanked them and smiled; they would smile back and we both felt good. It doesn't happen too often these days.

Discrimination challenges of all types will find lawyers and court dates here. Some lawyers specialize in them. Disabled organizations also provide assistance and lawyers for litigation. We've got a fairly decent ombudsman system as well as mediation processes in place. Of course, the newspapers are also very willing to play up any cases of discrimination, especially when a disabled person is involved. Nothing like a negative newspaper story to damage a business.

We seldom see class action suits related to discrimination (sometimes an indication of an issue that needs to be dealt with by a law) as many situations are covered out of court.

Ah, yes,... hearing loss ... that's been going on for years--ever since "mobile" stereo systems were invented, probably even before then. It's just not from ear buds or headphones either; there are car stereos, movie theatres, home theatres, music stores, rock concerts, race car tracks, motorcycles, boom boxes at the park or beach, etc., etc. Just because there is a volume button doesn't necessarily mean that louder is better.

I'm not dismissing the damage that soldiers receive from IEDs--any sort of long term or sudden, percussive loud noise is dangerous; construction workers or people who work in very noisy industrial facilities can also damage their hearing when they don't wear hearing protection.

But, Mama Beth, I'm sure that you'll agree that with some people it's the old maxim: You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink it. Unless a person understands and wants to protect their hearing, you'll have problems getting them to wear proper hearing protection.

Most, if not all, of our broadcast news reports (TV) are captioned and have been for years--the groups who support the hearing disabled have seen to that. It's part of the regulations of the CRTC--Canadian government body that regulates radio and TV broadcasts. I think that crawlers are also used by many major news organizations--it's a benefit to them. Many of our major radio and TV stations have online archives that you can access for up to a month after the broadcast--even for commercials on the radio--just so you can get the "where" or "when" or whatever that you missed.

The CNIB (Canadian National Institute for the Blind) and similar organizations have worked tirelessly for decades to get recognition for the problems of the blind: access for service animals, raised dots (similar to braille) on paper currency, specific shapes/milling for the edges of our large denomination coins, audible sounds for crossing lights at major intersections, etc.

Even if some of the building codes or other accessibility regulations aren't perfect, at least there is recognition for the problems of accessibility. There can be the greatest intentions by the building industry, but if a builder wants to cut corners or reduce spacing to a minimum--they will.
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Iona

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson